Defense wins, but Mayhew is still keeping open the possibility of drafting a defensive player. Screw smokescreens, fuck us Lion's fans.
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Defense wins, but Mayhew is still keeping open the possibility of drafting a defensive player. Screw smokescreens, fuck us Lion's fans.
To be fair, 10 of the top 13 scoring offenses also made the playoffs.
I think good football wins.
Close. The Giants (8th), Texans (10th), Steelers (12th), and Falcons (13th) did not.
The Jets, Cowboys, Ravens, Colts, Vikings, Chargers, Cards all give up less than 20.3 pts a game (7 of the top 14 defenses). Saints have a middle of the road defense, don't be surprised when they get beat in a shootout.
I think you need both to win. But teams have made runs with crappy offenses and dominant D (Tampa, Baltimore, Chicago to name a few). What team has won it all with a dominant O and a bad defense? The Colts in 2006 is the closest I can come up with (22.6 pts a game allowed).
My point is there is no way we can win without putting together a top 15 defense, even if Stafford and CJ light it up.
Stafford and CJ won't light it up without a left offensive tackle.
a LT won't stop the Lions from giving up 30 points a game either. I don't care if you have the best OL in football, you aren't going to win many games giving up 30 a night.
Tahoe won't win championships with his mindset.
Offensive lines keep your defense off the field.Quote:
Originally Posted by WTFchris
Culpepper wins championships.
We would have won it all if he had started for us this year.
Offensive lines don't see the field if your D allows the other team to ball control you.Quote:
Originally Posted by Tahoe
Again, name me a team with a good offense and bad D that won it all.
So lets draft a new QB and not protect him?
No, lets build a good defense and surround Stafford with a solid but not spectacular OL.
The Lions were 24th in sacks allowed this year. Some of those certainly fall on a rookie QB not knowing when to throw it away. Was this a good OL? No. But it wasn't like David Carr had in Houston. They rushed for 400 yards more than Indi, BTW.
cliche time...we are only as strong as our weakest link...and we have a weak link or 2 on our Oline.
06 Colts stepped it up on defense in the playoffs. Try again, Tahoe.Quote:
Originally Posted by WTFchris
And where did I say anything, anyfrickinthing, ANYTHING about winning it all?
I'm saying protect our number 1 draft picks and add to them with a Left OT.
I know we need a defense to win. I've been beating that drum on scout for 10 years.
You really need them both. Just look through the teams here:
http://www.pro-football-reference.com/super-bowl/
There aren't many examples of winning without being top 10 on both sides of the ball.
^ Egg Zach Lee
I'm just saying since we have invested high picks in our QB, WR and RB, help them foos out a lil bit.
So let's go with 2 weak links on the o-line. 2/5Quote:
Originally Posted by Tahoe
We have 3 weak links on the d-line. 3/4
We have 3 weak links in the secondary. 3/4
I wasn't too impressed with our LBs, but we can probably call them safe for now (by comparison).
The thing is, if you upgrade that d-line, it helps upgrade the secondary. I know upgrading the o-line upgrades the QB/RB, but our d-line got zero pressure. Our secondary was abysmal. We can grab a guard in the 2nd/3rd round to upgrade one of the bad spots on the line. 1st rounder on the DL, 2nd or 3rd not used on the OL goes to a DB/DL.
Quote:
Originally Posted by darkobetterthanmelo
I didn't know that was the gripe about him. So he's basically like a Darnell Bing, then?
I agree for the most part but I think we still need to go with the "protect your investment" thing. QB is still the most important position, period, and we have pretty much everything invested in Stafford. If he doesn't succeed, we're set back another 5 years, almost no matter what else we do. We obviously have massive holes on defense but outside of a once a decade talent such as Suh potentially might be, I think we need to do whatever we can to help Stafford succeed. It will be interesting to see how things shake out after the combines.Quote:
Originally Posted by Zekyl
No matter what, this isn't going to be a one or two year fix. We can improve in that time span but it's going to take 4-5 before we could possibly be real contenders (stop laughing). Since that's the case, I think it's important to spend another year reinforcing what we've already started to build. We potentially have 3 pro bowlers in Stafford, CJ and Pettigrew, let's build on that and then move on to the total package.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Wilfredo Ledezma
I don't have a gripe with him, but some feel he lacks elite speed. Bing was mediocre, Mays has been a stud playmaker at USC for a long time.
Because there is more weak links on this half of the team doesn't mean you go there, imo.Quote:
Originally Posted by Zekyl
The bolded part...It all depends on who's there obviously. I'm just sayin/still sayin Left OT is the first priority.
I can agree with both sides here...Quote:
Originally Posted by Tahoe
Been harpin' on a LT for 12 st8 years now... however the odds of landing a dominent D lineman after round one goes down exponentially (yes there are several excptions)... whereas you can snag a solid LT in the 2nd round.
At least finally most folks agree these are the two primary needs... but we coulda told em that for the past decade or so.... fuck the best player available.... nobody touches the ball with the QB counting stars.
The problem is, at this point, that there is no elite LT talent available this year. We'll see if that "changes" after the combine...
dr. ray, one thing i've noticed is that every year its said "there are no dominant left tackles". last year i was against going lt at #1 because there were 4 or 5 lts that had been mentioned as a possibity. so why take a guy at 1 when someone similar might be there at 20? (turns out this was right, since oher has been the best and was available. oh well).
however, okung has been the consensus top lt as far as i've seen. to me, thats a good sign. he's shorter than i'd like, but there are good lt's with his size. i think if suh isnt there you pretty much have to go with him (pending combine).
and tahoe is 100% right. forget what gives us the most wins in 2011. the lions future is all about stafford. he got beat to crap last year. knee, shoulder. how many surgeries? the lions are so far away from championship that thinking along those lines is definitly putting the cart before the horse. lets just get stafford right, since he looks to be the real deal, then worry about the finer details.
Well, they blew many chances to take a LT that I did want. I wanted Brown instead of Mike Williams. I wanted Oher instead of Pettigrew. We wouldn't have these questions of using the #1 (last year) or #2 (this year) pick on a OT if they had grabbed one when they had a chance.
Let's look at the AFC left tackles
LT
Baltimore
Jared Gaither 5th round 2007 supplemental draft
Cincinnatti
Andrew Whitworth 2nd round 55 overall 2006 draft
Cleveland
Joe Thomas 1st round 3rd overall 2007 draft
Pittsburgh
Max Starks 3rd round 2004 draft
Houston
Duane Brown 1st round 26th overall 2008 draft
Indianapolis
Charlie Johnson 6th round 2006 draft
Jacksonville
Eugene Monroe 1st round 8th overall 2009 draft
Tennessee
Michael Roos 2nd round 41st overall 2005 draft
Buffalo
Jonathan Scott 5th round (Detroit Lions)
Miami
Jake Long 1st overall 2008 draft
New England
Matt Light 2nd round 44th overall 2001 draft
New York Jets
D'Brickashaw Ferguson 1st round 4th overall 2006 draft
Denver
Ryan Clady 1st round, 12th overall 2008 draft
Kansas City
Branden Albert 1st round 15th overall 2008 draft
Oakland
Mario Henderson 3rd round 91st overall
San Diego
Marcus McNeil 2nd round 50th overall
So out of 16 teams, there are 7 with 1st round left tackles. Out of the 4 playoff teams remaining...
San Diego has Marcus McNeil, a top 50 pick.
Indianapolis has Charlie Johnson, a late round pick, who outperformed Tony Ugoh, a 1st round pick
The Jets have D'Brickashaw Ferguson, a top 4 pick
Baltimore has Jared Gaither, a 5th round pick, but could also slide Michael Oher over, a 1st round pick.
There are also a lot of 2nd and 3rd round picks in the rest of the teams.
well, 5 of the top 7 pro bowl tackles were early 1st rnd picks.
the position clearly needs to be upgraded. if we can get a good guy late in the draft great. but can they? i suppose we dont need a world beater, avg would be fine. but i hate the idea of putting a band aid on this and hoping for the best.
Not to piss in everyone's punch, but Schwarz said in his end-of-year presser that he loves Jeff and LT is one of 6-7 positions that he will not look to improve this offseason. He hoped Jeff would be selected to the probowl.
Jeff is a very good and decent sack of shit.
rofl. In all honesty, Cherilus, LG, and Raiola were worse than Backus this year.
im not going to get mad at that until he's actually brought back as a starter. i refuse to believe that the guys in charge are that stupid.Quote:
Originally Posted by Hermy
McShay has McCoy #1 now:
Quote:
St. Louis Rams
Record: 1-15
http://assets.espn.go.com/i/teamlogo.../trans/stl.gif
Gerald McCoy*, DT, Oklahoma
The Rams have a poor track record when it comes to drafting defensive linemen early, and now they have a tough choice to make between the stronger, more instinctive Ndamukong Suh and the quicker, more disruptive McCoy. Coach Steve Spagnuolo is looking for defensive linemen who can penetrate, which is why we think McCoy could be the top overall pick.
Detroit Lions
Record: 2-14
http://assets.espn.go.com/i/teamlogo.../trans/det.gif
Ndamukong Suh, DT, Nebraska
The Lions will gladly take Suh here. He won't provide the pass-rush production of McCoy, but he is a force versus the run and he consistently disrupts passing windows thanks to his excellent instincts and long arms.
Yeah, I'd still be thrilled with this mock. Donald Penn is probably impossible, but the rest of the FA's could happen (probably won't).
McCoy being talked about at #1 is great because either way we'd end up with a #1 worthy DT and less money than the Rams will have to pay.